Build Connections and Get Clients with Post-Episode Conversations | Steven Pemberton

Sadaf Beynon [0:06 - 0:13]: Welcome back to Podjunction Podcast, where podcasters learn to grow their business. I'm Sadaf Beynon and with me is Matt Edmundson.

Matt Edmundson [0:13 - 0:13]: Woohoo.

Sadaf Beynon [0:13 - 0:16]: Woo hoo. Again, again. We need that.

Matt Edmundson [0:16 - 0:18]: Yeah, we still need that. Yay.

Sadaf Beynon [0:18 - 0:41]: Yay. All right, so we're back again with another segment from Steven Pemberton and we are going to be talking about authentic relationships with our guest. So you'll be learning one, how to focus on building those relationships and not seeing them as a transaction. And two, the value of post episode conversations.

Matt Edmundson [0:42 - 0:46]: Oh, oh, I'm looking forward to this. The value of post episode conversations.

Sadaf Beynon [0:46 - 0:47]: Yeah.

Matt Edmundson [0:47 - 1:38]: Okay. So very warm welcome to you. By the way, if this is your first time with us, great that you've joined us. Please hit that like and subscribe button and do all of those good things that enable us to keep this podcast running. Because, you know, we actually quite enjoy this one. Yeah, it's quite. It's different format from all other podcasts. So that's why, that's why I like it. I like the dual aspect of it. Yeah, the two of us, the co host type thing. So, yeah, do make sure you do that. Of course, if you're regular to the show. Warm welcome back to you as well. Thanks for showing the love and hope you're getting some good stuff out of what we're doing. Just want to. I just love podcasting. I think it's a great tool to grow your business with. And so hence the reason we do this podcast. Hence the reason we have a podcasting company, I suppose. Hence the reason we have so many podcasts. And I just need to say the word hence, hence.

Sadaf Beynon [1:40 - 1:45]: And so hence, hence, henceforth moving forward.

Matt Edmundson [1:45 - 1:55]: One of the things that I said, and I'm sure it's not made it to the intro because I'm sure Josh has cut it out, but my challenge to you was to do this entire podcast in an English accent. You were like, there's no way.

Sadaf Beynon [1:55 - 1:57]: Yeah, I failed before I even started.

Matt Edmundson [1:58 - 2:08]: What's your favorite word pronounced with an English accent? I don't know, because you go around saying water a lot like you're English.

Sadaf Beynon [2:08 - 2:49]: Oh, that's because I'm just copying you. But yeah, actually, you know what, thinking about it, that was probably the first one because I remember. Can I. I'm just going to go on. Sorry. I remember being in boarding school in Pakistan and there was a guy from somewhere down south. I know that now, but he had this London down south in English. Yeah, okay. Yeah, yeah. Sorry guys. This cockney accent. And he would always Be like, pass the water. Pass the water, please. So, yeah, that's probably one of my first memories of it. Yeah. But then, you know, you've got Scouse.

Matt Edmundson [2:49 - 2:52]: English, so we got married to a Scouser.

Sadaf Beynon [2:52 - 2:55]: I did, I did. Whose accent isn't that strong. Actually.

Matt Edmundson [2:55 - 3:00]: No, it's not actually past the water mate.

Sadaf Beynon [3:00 - 3:10]: Yeah, we. Okay, sorry, I'm just gonna go on a bit longer. I found this. I found this book in the back of my wardrobe yesterday, and it was all these Scouse phrases.

Matt Edmundson [3:10 - 3:10]: Okay.

Sadaf Beynon [3:10 - 3:24]: So I gave it to my older son. I was like, here, you can have this. So they were all sitting at the dining table last night and my husband was reading them out, and we were all trying to guess what they meant. It was not easy or straightforward.

Matt Edmundson [3:26 - 3:31]: Did Geoff get them, though, being a Scouser, or was he actually. Some of these just don't make any sense.

Sadaf Beynon [3:31 - 3:35]: Well, he found it funny, but it's not stuff that he thinks actually makes sense.

Matt Edmundson [3:35 - 3:58]: Right, okay, fair play. Yeah. We've had things like the Scouse Bible. Learn yourself, Scouse. That was another book that we had when we moved in, which was great. Have you seen. We should probably get into the clip in a minute. But speaking of the cockney accent, if you haven't seen it yet, can I. Can I encourage you to go watch the clip of Chris Pratt?

Sadaf Beynon [3:58 - 3:59]: Yeah.

Matt Edmundson [3:59 - 4:09]: Who's the star lord? Isn't he from the Marvel movies? The Guardians of Galaxy? Yeah. So go watch Chris Pratt on the Graham Norton talk show.

Sadaf Beynon [4:10 - 4:10]: Okay.

Matt Edmundson [4:10 - 4:15]: Doing his impression of the Only Way is Essex.

Sadaf Beynon [4:15 - 4:15]: Okay.

Matt Edmundson [4:16 - 4:38]: Yeah. Towie. So if you just. If you don't know what I'm talking about, just Google it. Just Google Graham Norton, Chris Pratt, the Only Way is Essex. And it will come up. Right? And it's. He does the most perfect Towie accent because apparently when he was recording, they were living in London and his wife really got into this show.

Sadaf Beynon [4:38 - 4:39]: Yeah, yeah.

Matt Edmundson [4:39 - 4:45]: And so he just picked up the accent and it's just hysterical. So, yeah, you'll enjoy that little treat.

Sadaf Beynon [4:45 - 4:46]: Cool.

Matt Edmundson [4:46 - 4:52]: Anyway, before we get off too far on accents, Steve Pemberton.

Sadaf Beynon [4:53 - 4:53]: Yeah.

Matt Edmundson [4:53 - 4:57]: Should we get into his clip? Yeah, okay, let's do that. We'll be back after this clip. Here we go.

Sadaf Beynon [4:57 - 5:04]: Can we shift gears a little bit and talk maybe about how you've leveraged your podcast to grow your business?

Steven Pemberton [5:04 - 8:29]: Yes. This is something right from the get go, right from the beginning that I've done. And what's interesting because of being on a guest on so many shows is I was a guest on shows that had well over 200 episodes. I was a guest on a show that had over a thousand episodes. That's a lot of time. And I remember when I first started out, I mean, I was not very many episodes in maybe five or six, and I'd already gotten a client out of it. And I had a. I have a friend that he was well over 200 episodes, shut down his podcast because he had never gotten anything out of it. And the biggest difference I noticed between me and people that I've guessed it on their podcast is I just take a little extra time afterwards. And a lot of times when people that are hosts after a show, they'll just sit there and say, hey, Steven, thank you so much. It was amazing. You did great. Here's Next Steps. So Next Steps is in two weeks. Your show will be coming out on this day. We're going to send you all the material through email. If you wouldn't mind, just promote it. If you wouldn't mind, just put it up on Instagram. Here's some posts. And it's like, okay, that's great. You're giving me the logistics of what's next. And then it's like, okay, see you later. But you didn't actually discover, is there anything that we could do together? I have been sitting with you for an hour. You have built trust with me, I've built trust with you. So you can discover. It's like, hey, Steven, I know you said you're in ecommerce. I heard your story is great. It's. I'm actually starting my store or actually have my store. Is there a way for us to work together? And if we were to work together, what would that look like? And because now you're having a candid conversation, there's not a sales mechanism happening. And if you're trying to get clients, if you're like, hey, Steven, I heard that you are doing B2B ecommerce. I actually have been doing for the last 10 years, I actually have been working with companies just like yours to get appointments set. And I heard that that was one of the areas that you were kind of struggling in. Do you think maybe we could talk about a way for us to do that together? And it's like, okay, at least I'm interested because I'm there. Like, I trust you more than some random person who reached out to me on LinkedIn. You've built trust with me. So for me, that's what I do after every show, is I just want to discover who I've taken time to hear about you. Your business. At the end of my show, I'm always asking, it's like, what is one thing that you're overcoming in your life or your business right now? So I already know a struggle. And then for me is it's not about making a sale for me at the end of my show afterwards, it's okay, so you're struggling with your mental health. I know this great person. This is someone you need to talk to. Or I know this great book. My ideals is I want to make sure to help them solve their problems, not I want to get them to give me money. But I have found that doing it that way is the best way for you to be able to get clients, to be able to get more business, for you to get a stronger network, for you to have people that you can lean on. You got to realize as if you're. Especially if you're going to do this for a longer term than the next 90 days when you're having all these guests on is you want to build that network. So if you take a little bit of time afterwards pouring into them, you've already learned some of their. Their woes. You can help solve that. If you can solve that and your business can solve that, it's like, hey, I hear this. I hear that you're saying that this is one of the biggest issues you're walking through. This is actually something that we do, and I know that we do it well. And then they're willing to discuss. So for me with that, those were the areas that I've just seen grow my network. It's grown my business, and it's been really fun to do it in that way.

Sadaf Beynon [8:29 - 8:48]: That's really interesting. So do you then research your guests in a particular way when you've got this thought in the back of your head that you're going to ask them, how can we do business together? Or how can we work together? Or, you know, that kind of thing. When you're researching your guests, do you have that. Are you thinking about those kinds of things?

Steven Pemberton [8:48 - 11:18]: No. So I'll be candid. There is. I have a buddy that he does the podcasting thing on a large scale where he. But for him is what he does is he helps other people set up their podcast. And it is very much a sales funnel where from the calendly link, you get on there and it's like art. What is your monthly revenue marks? What did. What did you do last year? Okay, so what is your biggest problem? What is the. And this is you scheduling to be on a Podcast, when I go through those, I hate those because I know that they're trying to. It's trying to be a sales thing. And then when you do get on those shows, it is like, okay, Steven, so you said that you are making $100,000 a month in revenue. So what do you think is keeping you from making $200,000 a month? Okay, so that one thing, if there was somebody who could help you solve that one thing, would you be willing to pay them? It's like, I didn't know that I'm getting interviewed live. This is going to go out like I'm getting recorded. There's a sales call recorded live that you're going to be trying to sell me. And so for me, the way that I do it now, granted, I think that there's absolutely, for me, room and room for improvement on the guest side and just doing more research to understand who they are, what their business is, what they're walking through, to see before they even get on the show, is there something that I can do to help them. But normally for me, when they get on the show is I just want it to be organic. I don't want to show up with a preconceived notion that, hey, I know that your sales suck and I can help you get better at sales. So the whole time I'm asking you questions, it's like it's rabbit holing you down into where you realize it's like, oh, man, you know, I'm not actually good at sales or my sales are low. And then after the show, I'm telling you say, hey, so I know the whole time that we talked that you were talking about how sales have just been abysmal for the last six months, but for me is, I want it to be organic, a real conversation. Because if you can have it be a real conversation, you can find what actually ails them. But people are smart. I think that we don't give people enough credit. And people can pick up on your energy. So they can tell if you are like a shark in water and they've got a little paper cut. They can tell if you feel. If they feel like that you are smelling blood and water. So with that, what I mean by that is like, they can tell if the only thing that they. That you see them as is a transaction for me is it's all about relationship. So for me is if I can build the relationship through the call and discover what it is that they need through that podcast conversation, the afterwards conversation is so much better, especially when they don't feel like a transaction, there's people that they'll introduce me to, there's people that I'll introduce them to. And I've just seen the power of that over a long enough time horizon.

Sadaf Beynon [11:22 - 11:30]: If that got you curious and you want to catch the full episode, be sure to subscribe to the show. We've got plenty more great conversations coming up.

Matt Edmundson [11:35 - 11:38]: Welcome back. Welcome back. Love that. I'm loving the Steve Pemberton.

Sadaf Beynon [11:38 - 11:39]: Yeah, he's great.

Matt Edmundson [11:39 - 11:48]: He's such a full on guy, isn't he? In so many ways he's brilliant. So I'm loving the series. I'm loving. I can't wait for that. I've not actually heard the full interview.

Sadaf Beynon [11:48 - 11:48]: No, you haven't.

Matt Edmundson [11:49 - 12:02]: So I'm looking forward to that. I subscribe to this show because I fast forward the bits where I'm talking. So I really like the full interviews. So I'm looking forward to that. Yeah, that's cool, man. What did you get out of that?

Sadaf Beynon [12:04 - 12:08]: All right, so can't really read my notes because I can't really write that well.

Matt Edmundson [12:08 - 12:13]: But that's because you've got a few stressed.

Sadaf Beynon [12:15 - 12:25]: Yeah. So a few things first. I just go in order of what I've written down. I thought it was interesting that how one of his friends who didn't make.

Matt Edmundson [12:25 - 12:26]: Any kind of episodes and didn't do anything.

Sadaf Beynon [12:26 - 12:28]: Yeah. And he just shut it down.

Matt Edmundson [12:28 - 12:28]: Yeah.

Sadaf Beynon [12:28 - 12:30]: And I thought that was interesting.

Matt Edmundson [12:30 - 12:31]: It's a little bit sad really.

Sadaf Beynon [12:31 - 12:32]: Yeah.

Matt Edmundson [12:32 - 12:34]: Because I think so 200.

Sadaf Beynon [12:34 - 12:39]: Yeah. And I think like going back to like what he said right at the end about it being a transaction.

Matt Edmundson [12:39 - 12:39]: Yeah.

Sadaf Beynon [12:39 - 12:49]: So if you don't see it like that and just see as a relationship building, even if you're not making getting any clients out of your podcast, it's still a great tool to be able to network.

Matt Edmundson [12:49 - 12:49]: Yeah.

Sadaf Beynon [12:49 - 12:52]: And to meet people and to talk about what you do.

Matt Edmundson [12:52 - 14:02]: Yeah, yeah, it is, it is. I, I, I, I was really surprised actually when I heard that they got to episode 200 and nothing. You've got to question what's going off there. I think if you got to episode 20 and there's nothing really going on, something's not right. And again, well, it depends how. Define success, doesn't it? I suppose. And I think you have to be super clear on what that means in relation to your business, in relation to your services and what that means for you. But I think, I think it was just a bit sad. There's obviously some things not quite right and it's not that the pod. I don't think it would. And I'm saying this, I've never met him, never talked about the podcast, and I could be entirely wrong. I appreciate that. But it sounds to me like it wasn't a podcast issue. It was just more of a the way that the podcast was done issue. Because I still think podcasting is a really good, is a really good tool for doing what you want to do, you know, and I, I was a little bit surprised by that. But, you know, obviously horses for courses and all that sort of stuff. But steven, I think quite, it's quite interesting how he identified what people typically do at the end.

Sadaf Beynon [14:02 - 14:03]: Yeah.

Matt Edmundson [14:03 - 14:40]: Having been on so many podcasts and actually when I think about the podcasts I have been on, I would say this is probably true. 95 times out of 100, the podcast ends. We'll let you know when it's going to go out. Please share the links. Goodbye. And to be fair, I've probably been guilty of that myself on a fair occasions because I think if you're, if you're close to deadline in terms of time, you know, they've, you've got the top of the hour and you've only got three minutes and they want to get off. I think, I think it's easy to do that.

Sadaf Beynon [14:40 - 14:41]: Yeah.

Matt Edmundson [14:41 - 14:42]: But I don't think it's necessarily the best way.

Sadaf Beynon [14:42 - 14:59]: Yeah, I was thinking about that. Like, I think, you know, we always ask them, do you have a hard finish time? And so we make sure they're off the phone by then, off the call by then. But I think like, is it, would it be worth finishing the interview that a few minutes before that so you have that post episode conversation with them.

Matt Edmundson [14:59 - 15:34]: Yeah, absolutely. And it's one of the things that, I mean, even if your podcast is shorter in length, so having experimented with this a little bit. So if you've got an hour slot, rather than doing a 50 minute podcast, do a 40 minute podcast and give yourself 10 minutes. Even if they don't want to talk at the end, you've not really lost anything. But I think if you say, right, actually a hard line is on the hour, that means the podcast has to be finished by either quarter, two or ten to the hour. Because I need some space at the end to have a conversation.

Sadaf Beynon [15:34 - 15:34]: Yeah.

Matt Edmundson [15:34 - 15:54]: And it's just a discipline then, isn't it? And I think it's a really good way to structure it and it's a really good thing to do is to structure that final 10 minutes. Yeah, I was moaning about A coffee. This mustn't really. It's not really. Is it related? Yeah, it's probably related, but I was in a coffee shop the other day in.

Sadaf Beynon [15:54 - 15:55]: Drinking tea.

Matt Edmundson [15:55 - 16:17]: Yeah, drinking tea, because I don't do coffee. But I was in the coffee shop the other day and being in town, and I really like it. If you're ever in Liverpool, Liverpool 1, go to Bean Coffee shop, shout out to those guys. They're awesome. And every coffee shop has got the same thing, right? You go through this process, you stand in line, you walk past something which is usually full of treats.

Sadaf Beynon [16:17 - 16:18]: Impulse buy.

Matt Edmundson [16:18 - 16:58]: Impulse buy. You get to the till, you. You know what you want it to buy. You're greeted usually by someone who's very happy, very smiley, very genuine, very nice. And they're like, what you want? And been. I show them my little app that gets the reward points and it's all great. And I've walked past the treats and I feel good because I've not bought one, you know, as much as. Yet, as much as they would like me to have bought one in a moment. And as I'm ordering, maybe I've interacted a little bit with the person on the checkout. That whole experience is good, right? There is a point to this, I promise. What happens next in every single coffee shop?

Sadaf Beynon [16:58 - 16:59]: You wait next.

Matt Edmundson [16:59 - 17:10]: You wait. And it's. It's a. It's like everybody in the coffee shop sector has thought about the experience right up until the point that I paid. Right?

Sadaf Beynon [17:10 - 17:10]: Yeah.

Matt Edmundson [17:10 - 17:24]: We always complain about this in ecommerce. You know, everybody's like, we've got conversions. We've got to look at the website, We've got to do this and that and all the. Right up until the point they've paid. And then after you've paid, it's like, oh, okay, we know we're not interested in.

Sadaf Beynon [17:24 - 17:27]: You can't really abandon cart at that point in a coffee shop, can you?

Matt Edmundson [17:27 - 17:57]: No, no. You go stand over there and wait. And it's the most dull, uninteresting experience. And it's like no one's ever thought about it. No one's gone, how can I make this so good that they're so excited? I mean, it's like, how can I improve this experience? I don't know what the answer is because I don't run a coffee shop. But what I know is it's not what it is. And I think it's the same with podcasting, right? Everybody thinks and invests so much time and energy right up until the podcast has ended.

Sadaf Beynon [17:57 - 17:57]: Yeah.

Matt Edmundson [17:58 - 18:24]: Jamie, that's our pay point that we've got. We've got the transaction done, we've recorded the podcast, and then it's just all a bit flat, after all, a bit dull and dreary. And I kind of think. I think steven's right in the sense of if you can do something interesting in those 10 minutes. And I think I need to actually thinking it through, I need to get better at this because sometimes I just get so engrossed in the conversation that I run it right up until the max time.

Sadaf Beynon [18:24 - 19:25]: Yeah, he was talking also about. Talking to the guest about how can we help you as a business? So that kind of a transaction as well. But I think that would be something worth doing. You've just mentioned it for all hosts to be thinking about, what would those questions be? Because for everyone, those would be different. So I was thinking about what I do with Podjunction, because, I mean, obviously I'm not trying to really help them because we're all doing the same thing. And because I'm learning, this is still early days for me, My question is always, can you give me some feedback on how that was? And I find that, like, you know, it's. It's gold for me. And so making that time for it. And I found, like, there's some guests that were just really gracious with their time and would just hang out and just kind of go deeper. And others were like, you could tell by the body language, you know, I'm looking at the time I want to go. So just like, I don't ask or. Yeah, yeah.

Matt Edmundson [19:25 - 21:12]: And I think. I think it's an interesting question, but you're right. I think creating that space, having those questions that aren't hard sell questions. No, I think one of the questions I like to ask people is, how can I help you? Right. It opens so many doors. They know who I am. They know what we do. And just saying to the guests, listen, you've been on this show, really appreciate the value that you bought. I thought that was great, the way you shared, giving them feedback as a guest, just giving them, you know, a lot of gratitude. And then just following that up, going, listen, how can I help you, man? What's. What's one or two things maybe that I could do to help you? What would that look like? And it. And when I did, I don't do it every time after every podcast, but when I do do that, it just sparks some really interesting conversations. And we, you know, we do get stuff like, yes. I mean, you know, yesterday I recorded With Lucy. I said in the last podcast that yesterday records with Lucy too. It's not because I've recorded two podcasts with Lucy at all. It's just because we record these. Right. Trade secrets. So we record two every time. But yesterday I did, when I. A week ago I did a podcast record with. With Lucy and we spent probably 40 minutes chatting after the podcast had ended. And it was a really lovely and wonderful conversation and I, I hope it. And Lucy might tell me otherwise, but I hope it was helpful for, for her. And it all came down to Lucy, how can I help you? And it just, it just sparked. So I think know your guest hard deadline is one.

Sadaf Beynon [21:12 - 21:13]: Yeah.

Matt Edmundson [21:13 - 22:26]: Schedule some time at the end of the. Schedule some time in that to have a post podcast conversation. Try and be helpful in a way that makes sense for you and your business. Whether it was like steven, whether it's by the way I do it, whether it's way south as well. Experiment, figure out what, what works for you and then just have those conversations. Then the other thing that I would say is one of the things I learned yesterday is the podcast recording ended in the calendar. I can't remember the exact time. I think it was like 3:30. And then I had another podcast recording, schedule four, which meant I had to cut short the conversation I was having with Lucy. And I think in hindsight it would have been nice to have had a bit more time. And so I guess my learning and all of this as we're talking and I'm thinking it through, I think I'm going to schedule at least an hour between podcasts if I can, with the scheduling software that we have. Just so if these post podcast conversations do start happening, I've got the space and capacity to help people and to do some stuff there. So. Yeah, I thought that was brilliant. Yeah, brilliant, brilliant, brilliant. What else was in your notes?

Sadaf Beynon [22:34 - 22:36]: Are you comfortable with the silence, Matt? Just checking.

Matt Edmundson [22:37 - 22:41]: We're talking about that. We talked about that last week. Being comfortable with silence.

Sadaf Beynon [22:42 - 22:43]: I can't read. Whatever.

Matt Edmundson [22:43 - 22:47]: I'm only ever comfortable with silence when you're thinking of a deep. A really good deep.

Sadaf Beynon [22:47 - 22:48]: Sorry, sorry, sorry.

Matt Edmundson [22:48 - 22:51]: If that's what's coming, then great. If not. Come on, get a move on.

Sadaf Beynon [22:51 - 22:54]: There's something here I wanted to ask about.

Matt Edmundson [22:54 - 22:55]: You know your microphone's in the room.

Sadaf Beynon [22:55 - 22:59]: Yeah, sorry. Okay. I cannot read what I've written.

Matt Edmundson [23:00 - 23:02]: You can't read your own writing?

Sadaf Beynon [23:02 - 23:02]: Yeah.

Matt Edmundson [23:03 - 23:04]: With your fooshed wrist.

Sadaf Beynon [23:04 - 23:22]: Yeah. Yeah. Oh, well, I guess actually I can ask you a question that I can kind of Read. Have you been on. Have you been on a podcast where afterwards you felt like it's. It was a bit of a sales conversation or even on the podcast, because that's something Steven experienced.

Matt Edmundson [23:22 - 25:21]: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean, you, you know, you get invited on two podcasts, and I tend to say yes to maybe 80% of the requests that I get. There are some where I'm just like, I'm not interested. But I tend to say yes to about 80% of the requests, and I would say probably about 10% of them are, in effect, sales pitches. And I'm polite, I deliver value. But then I get off the call quick. And you know what? None of them are in my phone. I'm not still connected with them. I'm not still talking to them. There are podcasts that I've been invited on as a guest and have ended up buying things from them. But that's usually because, again, like, I think about Dan Biday, he does some of our email marketing in one of our Ecom businesses. And so Budai Media is a. Is a company that we do that with. He invited me onto the podcast. We had a great conversation. We stayed in touch. He just said, listen, Matt, how can I help you? We do these free audits if you're interested. Wasn't a sales pitch, which is literally a one line throw. And I'm like, yeah, sure, man. Why not? Let's see what. See what comes out of it. And then out of that, we ended up hiring him. And Daniel and I are still in touch, I think email. Sorry, Daniel, I've not responded to your email. I really should, but. So there have been occasions where I bought stuff off people, and then there's been occasions where I've been on the podcast. They've. They've not told me anything about themselves or any way that they can help me. And so the podcast kind of ends. And again, you don't really stay in touch with those kind of folks. The ones that I'm in touch with that I'm still connected with usually are the ones that took the time to just have a chat after the podcast or they have stayed in touch intentionally themselves. I'm thinking like Norm Farah. Right? So Norm, who's. He does an Ecom podcast. I think it's an Amazon podcast, actually. Norm's great. Got a massive beard, good branding.

Sadaf Beynon [25:22 - 25:23]: That is his brand.

Matt Edmundson [25:23 - 25:40]: It is his branding. Yeah. He's been on ep, but he invited me onto his podcast first. We had a great conversation. He was super kind, super generous. We had a good Chat afterwards. We've stayed in touch. I got him on the podcast. He's invited me back onto his podcast several times, which is another great way to.

Sadaf Beynon [25:40 - 25:44]: He's got a. Sorry, I'm cutting you off, do you want to finish?

Matt Edmundson [25:44 - 25:48]: I was just going to say it's a great way to stay connected. Invite them back. Sorry, but what were you going to say?

Sadaf Beynon [25:48 - 25:55]: I was going to say he's got a new podcast that he wants you on. I spoke to him the other day and he's going to be coming on Podjunction too.

Matt Edmundson [25:55 - 27:00]: Fantastic. Yeah, fantastic. He's asked me to actually do some content for something as well. Yeah. Anyway, so yeah, getting people to do some extra stuff is always helpful. We found with ep actually, if you have a great guest saying, listen, we've got a little community over here, would you fancy doing an hour long teaching session on this? Which is super practical. A lot of people say yes. So these kind of asks increase value and they increase relationship in so many ways and so definitely worth doing. The other thing that I found or I'm finding and so you will know this because I've requested some changes, is that actually I get everybody's WhatsApp number now and rather than just emailing in confirmations and stuff like that, actually I'm, I am going to say listen, whoever, Fred, we've got a podcast. Looking forward to that tomorrow and starting the WhatsApp conversations as well. Because I think it's so much better than email and maybe invite them into a WhatsApp group and all that kind of stuff. You know, it's, it's a really interesting idea.

Sadaf Beynon [27:00 - 27:07]: But also on that for you in particular, that's a touch point that you don't already have because I'm doing all the pre calls.

Matt Edmundson [27:07 - 27:08]: Yes.

Sadaf Beynon [27:08 - 27:13]: So you don't really meet them until you have the recording. So to have that is good.

Matt Edmundson [27:13 - 27:45]: Yeah, it's super important to create that connection. And also I think post like yesterday, sorry, a week ago when I was interviewing Lucy, I sent her a WhatsApp message after the call and it's so much nicer, so much more personal, I think. And why not do that? So, yeah, that's something that we're trying. Well, I'll keep you up to date. If we're not, if I've not mentioned it in a few weeks time, just prod me and see how we're getting on. But I feel like that's gonna also create these kind of connections, these post podcast conversations.

Sadaf Beynon [27:45 - 27:53]: Yeah. You mentioned Daniel Budai. So he's been on this podcast just, you know, early, early days. You don't remember.

Matt Edmundson [27:53 - 27:55]: He was. Yeah, yeah, no, because I did the original interview.

Sadaf Beynon [27:55 - 27:55]: Yes, you did.

Matt Edmundson [27:56 - 27:57]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Sadaf Beynon [27:57 - 28:01]: And one of the things he said in that was that he does this free audit, doesn't he?

Matt Edmundson [28:01 - 28:02]: Yeah.

Sadaf Beynon [28:02 - 28:17]: And he kind of show showcases his expertise as well as, you know, alongside the podcast he's also showing them this is what we can do for you as a business. So that's, that's another way, isn't it, to have those episode, post episode conversations.

Matt Edmundson [28:17 - 28:19]: It really is. And it's worked well for Dan.

Sadaf Beynon [28:19 - 28:20]: Very well.

Matt Edmundson [28:20 - 29:05]: Pre order thing has worked well for him because a lot of people, I don't know how many people, maybe one in three say yes. I don't know what his closure rate is on those. I think we covered it actually in the interview. But yeah, yeah, it's a really great way of doing it. If you've got something like. So he does email marketing. So actually doing an audit of someone's email marketing, go, actually this is great. This could be improved. This is how you would improve it. If you need any help, let us know is a really interesting way. It takes a bit of time but I think if you've got a good quality client who's your ideal market, it's a good way to do it. And so why would you not. Right. And trialing that I think is super helpful. So yeah, I know he's killed it with that. I think he's done super well and I don't know actually I need to catch up with him. I don't know if he's still doing super well. It's probably been a year since I had that conversation with him.

Sadaf Beynon [29:05 - 29:06]: I think a bit more.

Matt Edmundson [29:06 - 29:08]: Is it a bit more than a year? Yeah, probably.

Sadaf Beynon [29:08 - 29:10]: So, yeah, you should check in.

Matt Edmundson [29:10 - 29:20]: I should probably check in with Dan. Maybe getting back on the show. Dan Part two, how it's going with the free audit. Dun dun dun dun dun dun dun. Awesome. Anything else?

Sadaf Beynon [29:20 - 29:21]: No.

Matt Edmundson [29:21 - 29:39]: Well, listen, thank you so much for joining us and of course, if you would like to get in touch, we would love to hear from you. And if you are, you know, thinking about doing your own podcast and you haven't really started yet or you like the chap that's struggling with the 200 episodes. Do get in touch, we would love to hear from you. Well, Sadaf would who heads up Podjunction.

Sadaf Beynon [29:39 - 29:40]: I would.

Matt Edmundson [29:40 - 30:00]: And she'll. She'll make her magic. Magic. I don't even know what I was going to say. But do get in touch. We would love to hear from you. You can find out more at the website Podjunction.com you can reach out to us on social media as well. All of those links will be in the show notes. But yeah, that's it for me. That's it from you.

Sadaf Beynon [30:00 - 30:01]: It is excellent.

Matt Edmundson [30:02 - 30:04]: Have a fantastic week. We'll see you next time. Bye for now.

Sadaf Beynon [30:09 - 30:43]: And that brings us to the end of today's episode at Podjunction. If you've enjoyed the insights from this episode and want to hear the full conversation with today's special guest, don't Forget to visit Podjunction.com where you'll find more information about how you can join Podjunction cohort. Whether you listen while on the go or in a quiet moment, thank you for letting us be a part of your day. Remember, every episode is a chance to gain insights and to transform your business with podcasting. So keep on tuning in, keep on learning and until next time, happy podcasting.

Steven Pemberton [30:45 - 30:45]: Sa.