Mastering Interviews and Elevating Your Podcasting Game | Daniela Woerner

Welcome to Pod Junction where Business Meets podcasting, whether you're on a morning jog, driving to work, whipping up a meal or just taking a moment for yourself. Our weekly bite sized episodes promise fresh insights from successful podcasters who have cracked the code of using podcasts to grow their business. So whether you're a podcasting newbie or seasoned podcaster, grab your notebooks and get ready. So, hello, welcome to episode number two of PD Junction. My name is Mad Monson beside me as always on the PD Junction is the beautiful, the talented, the awe and awesome person, which is set on how we doing. Good. Thanks. I'm gonna have to, gonna have to up the ante episode 26. Like what do I say that's different? Uh So I'm gonna have to quickly check on chat GP T for some uh some good instructions.

Welcome to episode two. Yes, where we talk about how to use podcasting to grow your business here on Pod Junction. Uh And yeah, we've been around podcasting for a little while. We have, it's fair to say a fair few years. Um I, I've lost count of how many podcasts I've recorded over the years. Uh whether they're my podcast as in, you know, something with my name on it or whether it, I'm as a guest on somebody else's podcast, don't know a lot, a lot. But it's fair to say I'm enjoying this one.

The cohost one's quite fun. This is fun. Yeah, normally, normally it's just me and me and a guest as in, you know, I do the interview style, like a lot of people do because it's easy. Um But I'm enjoying this one. I'm enjoying the new format. So yeah, we'll see where this takes us because you know why not? Welcome. Welcome to the uh the pod junction. If this is your first time with us, do make sure you like and subscribe and all that sort of good stuff because you know, why would you not want to um why would you not want to? Indeed. So yes, today's guest, let's talk about toda's guest.

You talk about today's guest.

All right. So today we are having Daniella Warner again again again. She was in the last episode and we are going to be watching another, another clip from her episode with Matt, a recording with Matt. And yeah, so if you missed the first one, she is the host of spa marketing. Made easy. Thank you, Matt. It's almost like we rehearsed that. Yeah. Um Yeah, so she's going to be talking to us a bit more, giving us more insight into how she does things and we are going to learn from her. Yeah, absolutely. I think we're talking about interviewing.

I think that's what the clip is. I can't remember actually such as my level, I like a goldfish. 10 seconds later. I'm like, what? I don't know. Hence the reason I have my notes, I have to take copious notes whenever I do anything.

So, yes, we have got the amazing Daniella who is going to have a conversation with us and then after the conversation, what we're going to talk a bit about what she's shared with us and how we can take it away and use it in our own podcasts. Absolutely. Yes, we are so set up and I'll be back in a few moments after this. Here's Daniel, you know, found that interviewing also is a skill and so understanding how to ask interesting questions or how to lead your guest. Um, in the right way, we've, we've never done really scripted, you know, sometimes podcasts they'll send you like, these are the questions that I'm gonna ask.

I've never done that. Um And the feedback that we've gotten from our listeners, which is not the same for everybody, but they say that they love that. Sometimes we go on tangents and they love that. It's, they feel like a fly on the wall of just listening to someone's conversation. I was always aware of them with a podcast.

I wanted it to feel like, uh with the guests that I was in a coffee shop. Do you know what I mean? I would have sat down having a con, I mean, ironically, I was in a coffee shop yesterday with two of the podcasters, both of whom are going to be on the podcasting series. Um And we were talking about podcasting just like you and I, you and I are now. Um And uh iii I quite like that.

I quite enjoy that. It feels quite intimate, it feels quite personal. It's interesting you get drawn in. Um And so I can see why that would be a good formula. Formula is a wrong phrase.

Why that would be a good way for you to do that. Yeah, nice approach. So what are some of the things then you've learned about interviewing? You, you said obviously this is a skill that you've learned. I'm kind of curious to dig into that a little bit if I can. Yeah. So, you know, this kind of started when we started getting some higher level guest on our show, we've had some really incredible people on and a lot of times if a high level guest is doing like a book launch or something like that, they'll, they'll, they're just like on a podcast tour where they're doing over and over and over and you listen to some of those episodes and they're talking about the same, it's the same interview over and over and over. And so what I'll do is listen to those and then I'll think of like, how can I ask a different question? How can I make my interview different than these set talking points that they're already looking at? So that number one, they remember you, number two, they know that you actually did your research and care, you read their book, right? And did all of that kind of stuff. So that is one thing and I think to um always remembering and tying it back to who the listener is.

So, because we serve spa owners, sometimes we'll have um somebody on the show that's not in spa, but it's always like tying it back to well with this topic for a spa owner and really kind of keeping the conversation there. I think benefits our listeners because at the end of the day, this is value for them. So, II I love that. So you're tying the value back into your listeners all the time, uh which is great. And the other thing you mentioned there, which had, um it doesn't surprise me about you, but you'd be surprised how many people don't do the research thing, right? And, and don't dig into their guest. So how much time do you spend prepping for your podcast?

So, someone's coming on to your podcast next week. What's the sort of, I guess, what's the, the timetable for you? What does that look like? It depends on who it is. Um I, at this point in our career with our podcast, we are very blessed to be very particular in who gets on the show. And so a lot of the guests that we're having on, I already know their work.

I already know I've read their books. Um, you know, we had Daniella Port on when her book, her most recent book came out and I did read, you know, the galley copy ahead of time and, you know, had pointed that out, but I already had followed her for years. So I knew her work. So there wasn't like a massive amount of research that I needed to do. Um We had Brendan Can on who is well known in the social media world.

He, yeah, he's worked with Taylor Swift and Rihanna and just all these kind of, he started, started the influencer marketing kind of trend. So for him, I didn't know who he was ahead of time. So I was going through, he's written a couple of books and so I read his book um beforehand and then that gave me the opportunity to ask meaningful questions because you always, you know, for podcasters, you always get those emails. It's like, oh, I'm, I am so excited about small marketing made easy, especially this episode and it's like cut and paste, it's automated. It's like you actually have no idea who I am what the podcast is. So delete, you know. Um but I like our listeners, you know, especially, or our guests that have written a book or done some type of creative work that obviously took a massive amount of their time.

I like them to know that I honor that. And I value that and I took the time to actually review and read and ask meaningful questions of that, that's so important for them. And I think that we get way better interviews because they're like, oh, this person actually cares about how much energy I poured into this book, right? Instead of just asking the suggested questions. So, but, but I'm guessing Daniella and correct me if I'm wrong, not all your guests will have got books which they can send you ahead of time, which you can read, right? So how else do you dig in to find those meaningful questions?

I look at their Instagram, I look at their website. Um If it, if it's someone that is referred to me by one of my friends, I usually hop on a 30 minute zoom beforehand with no agenda, I just say I want to just see if we can have a conversation, you know, tell me about you who are you as a person. Um And that's really important for me because if someone is um uncomfortable on camera or if they're uncomfortable, just kind of going with the flow without a specific agenda that's not going to make for a great podcast. So I like to get to know who they are as an individual. Can I joke with them? Are they, you know, like, what is their vibe? And I can always tell if we can keep a conversation going, then it's going to be a great interview.

If you're intrigued and want to dive deeper into this conversation, check out pod junction cohort where you can listen to the complete interview and much more simply visit the pod junction dot com for more information about how to join. Welcome back. We are talking about interviewing. Oh yes, the interview style podcast uh from Dan Yellow. And uh like I have just said there in the break, if you want to check out the full interview with Daniella, make sure you check out how to join the cohort at the pod junction dot com.

Get the right domain. There we go. I was almost going to say the Ecommerce podcast. This is the wrong podcast. Matthew, that's not the one we're doing today. Uh So yeah, great, fascinating conversation there.

Now, I, you may not realize this. Uh but whilst that clip is playing, we are, we still stay sat here, don't we? And this is where we take copious notes just to remind ourselves of what the guest said, which is great and stuff that we're gonna talk about. So, um I have lots of notes uh from Daniel or interviewing um because you again, really encourage you to listen to her podcast by marketing made it easy. Um, and just listen to how she talks to guests and how she draws things out from them. It's remarkable. Very, very good interviewer, uh, is Danielle and she put people at ease quite well. Um I know this because I was a guest on her show. Oh, yes. Uh And she was right when she, she, one of the things that she said she ties everything back to the, the listener, she thinks about the listener, she ties everything back. So I go on to a spot, marketing, made easy podcast, uh talking about e-commerce, right? So how to do Ecommerce? And so all her questions were very important, like, well, what would that mean for someone who's in the spar industry? How, how would that work for them? Uh And that's why I love that interview because it became very specific and very, uh very, very niche down to her audience. And she obviously cared deeply about her audience and making sure I was delivering value for her audience. Right? Yeah, I think that's really important actually because um it, it keeps the listeners engaged even like, you know, you're from e commerce. But how, like you're saying, how does she tie that back into? How, how do you make it applicable to them? How can they take something away from that?

Which I think is good. Yeah, it totally is very, very clever. So when you're interviewing people and if you're involved in podcasting, the chances are very strong, you're gonna be interviewing or chatting to somebody. Um You've always got to tie it back to the listener. That's the top tip.

It's like because fundamentally the listener has got to stay subscribed. They, they, you need them to keep coming back. And that's how your podcast grows, right? As you keep your subscribers. Um And the way you keep your subscribers is you keep delivering value, you give them a reason to keep listening. And so if you're using podcasting, um and your chief business Growth Strategy is to build a tribe um or a uh uh a following of people that listen to your podcast and listen to it. Well, you've got to deliver consistent value. Um And so, uh again, this is something that I dare say we'll talk about in the future, like how to choose good interview guests and all that sort of stuff. Um Danielle is very, very choosy. We have, we have the ban on, we have the set up when it comes to choosing, I guess, don't we?

So, um so like Daniella, we do the pre we call it the pre cool. So she jumped again something she mentioned that she jumps on a call, quick 20 minute call, no agenda just to find out if there's, I love this word vibe. Are we gonna vibe? I just understand the vibe. I feel so young using the word. But um and that's the beauty of the prequel.

There's many reasons why I think prequels are a good idea, especially if you're interviewing people that you've never met, but I don't do them anymore. You do that? I do them. Yeah. So, um, I've got to hold together that, you know, make sure that this, this person is going to deliver value, but also someone who's going to be able to have a good conversation with you, um, on the, on the podcast. So on the Ecommerce podcast. So it's interesting, isn't it? And I dare say, um, we'll do a whole episode about pre calls, uh, that we'll probably do multiple episodes calls because we learn a lot from them. But just to say a pre call is not a bad idea if you're doing interviews and don't be afraid to say no. Right. Do the bay. You're not afraid to say no, I'm not afraid to say no.

It's quite ruthless, not gonna lie. Uh So, yeah, I've had people writing, you know, in tears after the prequel was set. No, uh, brutal. Uh, which is not true at all. Um But yeah, it, it is an interesting thing to do. So the way you find good guests, especially people that you don't know is you use the pre call and find out if there's a vibe, are they going to deliver value to your listener? Yes or no. And then when you're talking to them, you're constantly thinking about the listener and the way you do that the way I do it, for example, on Ecommerce is I have several people in my head as, as we're going through the conversation. So I'm always thinking about those people that start out on e-commerce, you know, what would they want to know in this situation? Um I'm thinking about someone who's maybe involved in an ecommerce team. What do they want to know in this conversation? And I'm thinking about probably our third type of listener on the show are people who are leaders ceo s of companies that aren't necessarily involved in the day to day of ecommerce, but they want to understand it because it's a significant part of their business. And so I'm like, well, what would they want to know in this situation? And so then that guides the questions.

Now, the good news for me is because I'm involved in e-commerce. I am most of those people. Um And so I find it's really straightforward to ask those kind of questions because the questions that I genuinely want to know the answers to which I think is part of the thing that makes it interesting is you ask questions that fit your audience, but questions that you genuinely want to know the answers to if that makes sense. So, yeah, what else did you take away from Daniel's Chat?

Yeah, I, I quite liked how methodical she is with her research on, um on the guest, I think. Well, a part of me was thinking, how does she find the time to do that? Um, but I see the value in it. Um, I think, and also the fact that she, she makes it so clear to the guests too that she values them, you know, the hard work they've done and like, you know, what they're bringing to the table and she draws it all out for her listeners.

I think it's fantastic. Um, I think there's a lot to, for us to learn even from, from that. So, yeah. Yeah. The, the and again, it's an interesting one, isn't it? How much time do you spend? And Daniella's answer is quite insightful because she's, it depends on who the guest was and how well she already knows him. And so reading between the lines and I don't want to put words in Daniella's mouth, but I think there is a level of knowledge that Daniella would like to have per guest. So if she feels like she knows you, she's not going to spend as much time on the research.

Whereas if she doesn't know you, she's going to spend a bit more time on the research because she wants to deliver value for her listener. But two help as the interviewer, she wants the interviewer to feel like this is a great place. Sorry, there's been an interview, the guest, they, they, she wants him to feel like this is a great place to be, doesn't she that's what it comes across as well. Yeah, which is great. Um And she kept using this phrase like um this word care, didn't she? She wanted the guest to understand that she cared deeply about them, took time to research them and understand them. And I think again, when you do that, the benefit of that is the guest feels more at ease.

You do know more about them. So you do get to ask more interesting questions. Conversely, you get to deliver more value. So there's this sort of, you know, there's very good reasons as to why you would want to do that, I think um just value all around. So what are some of the things we do for research? Um Well, we asked, we asked some, um we ask everyone who's applying to be on our show because we're in this great position where we're not having to look for people.

We get people knocking on our doors. And um so we, we asked them for their websites, their linkedin their social media handles. And so then I'm, I'm scouring at those making sure that they kind of um are gonna fit our audience and what they're gonna talk about. We don't like to be salesy at all. So we actually just want a real um conversation that's just gonna bring a lot of value to our listeners and we're not, you know, not trying to push any, any uh particular service or product on them, we just want it to be a valuable conversation.

So, yeah, that's what I'm looking for, in essence. Yes, I mean, just to circle back on a point that you made there. Um Before we dive into that a little bit, we what tends to happen with podcasting. If you're starting out and you're starting a new podcast, you kind of have to hustle to get the guests, right. So it's just a case of asking.

It's a numbers game in a lot of ways, you've got to go and ask a lot of people and a bunch of people will say, yeah. Um, not everybody but what we, we found this with Ecommerce, wasn't it in the early days of Ecommerce podcast was we had to work really hard to go and get guests to come on the show. I mean, we had to think about who we were gonna have, go and invite them. They would never get back to you. And it just, you know, we would then go and ask more people. Um And then I can't remember when it was, but we hit like a turning point in the podcast. It was like episode maybe 30 somewhere.

I think it was season three, season three. So it would have been, yeah, sounds about right. Yeah. 30 episode 40 somewhere around there because season one had 20 episodes. Go figure, I don't know what. And so when we hit that number, there's this thing about consistency that when you hit, when you hit consistency and you're podcasting, you're constantly putting stuff out. Um People, I've just dropped my pen. So, um, people then reach out and they go, can we come on your show? And I remember we walked into the office one day, didn't we? And we were just like, 00, people have, we've got people wanting to be on this, they've asked if they could be on the show.

Oh, this is interesting. Um So at that point, we've never, from that point onwards, we've never really had to go and hustle guest unless there was someone in particular that we really wanted on the show and we went after them. But otherwise, no, no, no. And so it was interesting because we just, it was just this magical turning point, wasn't it in the, in the whole thing? Uh this influx? And so after a while, we're like, OK, how do we sift through all the applications that then became a problem?

Which is when we said, right, everyone has to fill out the application form on our website. So we had all the information together and we could go away and research them. And so we would look at say you would have a quick look at them and then go yes, these guys would at least do the pre call. So not everybody makes it to the pre call, right? And then not everybody makes it through the pre call, um, to the show. So there is this sort of filtering process, isn't there?

That sort of happens along the way. Uh And yeah, that tends to work quite well for us. Um, so anyway, that, that is an aside, if you're starting out again, turn it back to the, to the listener if you're starting out and people aren't asking you to knocking on your door saying, can I bring a shit? Don't worry, it'll happen. There's no doubt people will, the pod, the podcast agencies will find you. Um But let's, you mentioned the sales thing, just let's just talk about that real brief. Ok. So, ok, so yeah, we don't like to try to get inside your head there. Good luck. Yeah. Um Yeah, so we don't like to um we don't like for our guests to come and just talk about what they're selling because, you know, most guests wanna be for, for ecommerce, they wanna come on and they wanna talk about what they do to hopefully get some, um you know, some, some of our listeners to go sign on with them or whatever it is that they've got going on. But we don't really wanna make that the, the focus of our, of our episode. And Matt, you're a great host like you still bring out, you still bring out what it is they do and what it is that the, our listeners could benefit from, from the services they offer. But it's not, it's not like you're not pushing it. And so the main thing always for us is to bring value to our listeners. Always, always. And I think the best interviews and the best guests are the ones that bring the most value. And ironically, I always say this to guests when they come on the show. If you deliver insane value, you'll have people reach out to you and connect with you, which is ultimately what they want, right?

That's what they want, they want people to reach out and connect with them. So you'll have that um as a guest if you deliver great value. So your job as the interviewer is to draw that out of them. Um And so just circling back to one of the things that um Daniella said right at the start actually was the feel of it. Like it was a conversational feel. And um I mentioned that we'd like to have the idea as a coffee shop.

You know, you sat down chatting to somebody I never wanted like the formal interview um like here's 20 questions. Um And we're just gonna work through them one by one now for some people that works super well, right? And if that's you, that's awesome because you know what those questions are and you can just work through them with your guests. And so I've been on podcasts where they send you the questions ahead of time and you can just see them working through them, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. And maybe there's, you know, there's a number of shows where they ask the same questions to different people because obviously the answers are always gonna be different. And that in itself is interesting.

That's not what we do. So my style of interviewing and the same with Daniella actually um is very much like I'm going to riff off of everything that you've just said. So a bit like our conversation now, it's like, oh you mentioned this, let's just talk about that. We have no agenda. There's no, I wish I could tell you we've got 14 points that we need to get.

Yeah, we're gonna watch this clip and chat. That's as far as it gets. And so that tends to be our style when we do the interviews. We I like that conversational. So you do go off some rabbit trails. It does mean that everything's not hyper focused, which is an interesting one because some people like that hyper focused, which is why you do this, the fixed questions because it becomes hyper focused around that. So I could have with Daniel who has gone, right? Tell me, how do you prepare for an interview? What kind of questions do you ask in an interview? How do you determine if it's a good question or not? Um And then just ask those questions, but I didn't, it was very much a conversation that was flying and I, I prefer that and I think our listeners and I appreciate there are different listeners for different shows, but our listeners tend to prefer that style.

Um, because they feel like a flannel wall. And Daniel. I made this really interesting comment they, that she gets positive feedback when they go on these rabbit trails, I call them rabbit trails, this sort of tangents and, you know, the guests love that, uh, which I think is always fascinating. Um So, yeah, you, when you're interviewing don't be afraid just to go, I think it could be a really interesting question if I ask this dot dot dot um and we'll get into this a whole lot more cos, like I say, a lot of the shows are interview style shows. We'll tell you a lot of the stories, a lot of things that are gonna come out of it. Um But yeah, just keep it from us from Danielle.

The thing that I'm learning is keep it cas but do the research. Um Do your prep, make sure you're asking the, the phrase that she used? And I highlighted it is ask meaningful questions. And the reason why I highlighted it is because obviously I say obviously you might not know um with or media, we have a podcast agency and we're talking and we always talk about how it's about setting up and starting meaningful conversation. Um And for me, that's the power of podcasting is it's, you know, meaningful connections, meaningful conversations, asking meaningful questions. And you'll be amazed how quickly you can get into these things. Um But yeah, do the research put the time in so you can do these meaningful questions and ask meaningful questions questions. And again, she said it, didn't she?

That um if you've got somebody who's doing a podcast tour, which we get a lot of um a new products coming out, a new books been released and they're doing a tour when it's going on all the shows, you can just ask the same questions that everybody else is asking, but it's just, I don't know. Yeah. Yeah, I always, excuse me. Um Yeah, I always like to research what they have been doing on other podcasts. So we're not asking the same questions.

I think it's nicer for them as well. Like, you know, because there's so many layers to conversation, aren't they? So being able to peel back the layers just makes it so much more valuable. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And here's, I appreciate if you're starting out in podcasting, you might be going well. How do I know if I can do the interview thing? Right? Um And the same answer we say to everybody, if you can have a conversation, you can do the interview thing.

If you are interested in the person in front of you, you'll have an interesting conversation because you'll ask interesting questions or meaningful questions. Uh As Danielle called it Right? I think also, like she said, interviewing is a skill, but it's a skill that can be honed. And I think if you're gonna jump in and start podcasting, that's a skill that's gonna develop as you do it, it's not gonna just, you're not gonna show up on the first day with it, it's gonna come. Yeah, sorry to report that. Ladies and gentlemen in case you didn't know. Um And again, I think if you listen to some of my earlier interviews, um they're very different to the interview style that I have now, right? Very, very different. My whole podcast voice is very different.

I've learned how to intern use tone and all this sort of stuff. I've learned how to do a different style of interview. Now, if you listen to our podcast in 30 episode time, they'll probably be slightly different again because again, we always evolve and we change, we learn, we develop, that's the beautiful thing about podcasting. You should definitely be doing that taking notes, you know, what could I have done better? What questions could I have asked better? Um But I think like you say, it's a skill and we can, we can get better at it, so do get better at it. Um You know, do get better at doing the interview thing um and figure it out as you go along and just, you know, one of the ways I like to do this actually at the end of a recording is just debrief with the guests.

We don't record it. I probably should record it because actually those debriefs are really interesting. Um But just asking questions like, um, what could we have done better? Um Is there anything that we, we didn't talk about that you wanted to talk about? Just trying to, not that I'm necessarily going to go rerecord the episode. But um it just enables me to, to understand how to read people better and understand people and we do our prep better. Um But you know, it feeds my ego and maybe all the guests that come on my show, say the same thing to all everybody else's guests, but they always end up saying something online.

This is one of the top podcasts we've been on. So, um being interested in people and asking interesting questions does make you memorable, which is important if you are going for a strategy and your podcasting, um business growth ideas, like if you're using what we call the high value client strategy where your, your guest is a potential client, well, then interview becomes a whole much. I mean, it becomes a very, very important. Then again, we'll get into this in future episodes. But um yeah, if you're, if you're doing it for your listener, that's one thing if you're doing it to try and win that client over to like you, so you can then have an inro into their business you really need to be on your game uh and hiding your interview skills down again.

It's not complex, but you just need to be aware that you can't just show up and it's gonna be fine. So, yeah, anything else that we should throw into this conversation? Um No, I think we've covered it. I think we have indeed covered that. So, another fascinating conversation, do check out Daniella's podcast bar marketing made easy. um and reach out to her just say how is it, you know, because she's an absolute legend and just uh tell her, Matt said hi. Uh she's, she's super, super awesome. So do check it out.

We will have some more clips from Daniella at some point in the future. I have no doubt, but I think our next episode, we might have a different guest on uh you would know because you've planned them. I just sit down and talk to you next, come back for the next one. So yeah, do join us. Do make sure you like and subscribe.

Thanks for joining us on this one. We will see you next time. Absolutely. Bye for now. And that brings us to the end of today's episode at Pod Junction where Business Meets Podcasting. If you enjoyed the insights from today and wish to hear the full conversation with today's special guest. Don't forget to visit the pod junction dot com where you'll find more information about how you can join today, whether you listen while on the go or in a quiet moment. Thank you for letting us be a part of your day. Remember every episode is a chance to gain insights and to transform your business with podcasting. So keep tuning in, keep learning and until next time happy podcasting.